[Retros] rights & ocassions / not answering Andrew anymore

[Guus Rol]

Dear Andrey,

I can smell the ghostly presence of Gödel in this room. Lets construct a
fairy form which "prohibits following any rules and conventions designed to
describe its behaviour".

I do not really believe that fairy forms are designed in order to squash
existing rules and conventions. Most authors are trying to
demonstrate ideas and are quite happy to achieve this under the cover of
powerful embracive principles. It doesn't matter that these principles do
not apply to an infinity of fairy form as long as they work in a big enough
environment. Or in the space of your metaphor: Only so many colors are
needed on a painters palet to express himself; Would he cry over the
infinity of color frequencies missing in the spectral analysis of his
paintings?

With regard to the changing FIDE rules, I think "dating" is still the
safest option. It is only fair to expect that compositions follow the rules
and conventions at the time of their creation. Since everyone can locate
the different versions of the law on the Internet, this is less of an
obstacle than it used to be in the "old" days.

Best wishes, Guus Rol.


On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 12:32 PM, afretro <afretro at yandex.ua> wrote:

>  Dear all,
>
> Fairy chess is believed to be a form of art, isn’t it? Can we establish
> any basic principles governing e.g. the depiction of humans in the realm of
> paintings?
>
> As soon as we enact any basic principles governing the application of
> rules and conventions in fairy chess composition, someone will come up
> (like Nicolas did) with a new fairy type rendering these principles
> meaningless.
>
> In an article published almost a decade ago in *feenschach*, Kornilov and
> I noted that the limits of fairy chess had been expanded to such an extent
> (there are types in which there is no mate, like Losing Chess, etc) that it
> wouldn’t come as a surprise if one day someone declared card games a form
> of fairy chess.
>
> Moreover, if we decide that the best strategy in the less fairy domain is
> to stay tuned to the changing FIDE rules, chaos is bound to grow.
>
> Yours,
>
> Andrey
>
> 05.06.2014, 13:17, "Guus Rol" <grol33 at gmail.com>:
>
> Hi Nicolas and Kevin,
>
> Since the completion of the Babson task I am certain that every idea in
> chess which can be conceived, can also be realized. Of course there are
> constructions where 3R has a negative impact. As there are construction
> where the castling convention has a negative impact, the e.p. convention
> has a negative impact or any rule in the FIDE rulebook has a negative
> impact. Even the presence of the square h1 on a chess board has been known
> to frustrate the realization of some brilliant compositions!
>
> I am in general not very worried about those impacts. What I am worried
> about is negative impacts on the soundness, the consistency, the coherence,
> the workability, the conceptual justification and the computability of the
> whole system of rules and conventions. I decided long ago that having
> automatic termination rules/conventions makes sense without partcularly
> caring about what is in the FIDE laws at present. And see, what happens in
> 2014? The FIDE is about to implement automatic draws for both repetition
> and no-progress situations to suit the computer boys. "Computibilty" is the
> access code for the 21st century. Lets get rid of the code for the previous
> one: "I am an expert in interpreting chess rules and convention at 50$ per
> hour".
>
> Best wishes, Guus Rol.
>
> On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 2:55 AM, Nicolas Dupont <
> Nicolas.Dupont at univ-lille1.fr> wrote:
>
> Hi Kevin,
>
>
> I stress that 50M is non-analogous, because it has never been established
> that 3R has any negative consequence -- 50M severely limits the composer's
> free expression, and there is no evidence which suggests that 3R has a
> similar impact.
>
> If not already existing, it is certainly not difficult to construct an
> ad-hoc fairy condition, such that 3R has a negative impact...
>
> Nicolas.
>
>
>
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