[Jacob-list] LGDs

Tue Aug 1 18:43:29 EDT 2006

Hello Cathy,

       I didn't read the messages that you initiated earlier. I am sure there are good guard dogs and bad guard dogs and good guard llamas and bad guard lamas. I'm glad yours are working out for you.
       I doubt that any guard dog or guard llama either could stand up against a pack of dogs or a pack of coyotes. I have seen dogs that were killed and torn to shreds by a pack of coyotes.
       I have also had guineas and although they are great bug eaters and alarm sounders, I could not keep them on our property and they were extremely noisy so I had to get rid of them.
       Of course I don't agree with some of the points listed, but as I said before, whatever works for you is great. I do agree that there is nothing as good as a good fence. Our property line fences are high tensile woven wire with three strands of high tensile electric wire on the inside. 

  Carl @ 4Horn Farm's Jacob sheep
       .

Cathy Robinson <perfectspot at blueridge.net> wrote:
  Not too many weeks ago I initiated a discussion on this list about llamas and guarding sheep.  With the influx of new residents into our area, I was thinking that in the future we might need to move to a more silent guard.  Like Sharon, we have 2 Pyrenees that have done a wonderful job for us, but one does bark a lot.  I was almost convinced that a llama might be worthy of consideration until this same discussion came up just this week on a Great Pyrenees discussion list that I belong to.

I have spoken with several people that use llamas as guardians and swear by their efficiency, but after reading the comments on that topic this week from people involved with both LGD's and llamas (one was with llama rescue), I am now rethinking the issue for us.  Here are some of the points taken from those discussions.  These are not my personal thoughts; I am merely passing information which those of you who have (and like) your llamas may not agree with.     
   Llamas should be thought of as a sentry rather than guard.  They will alert and even rush to the fenceline if faced with a threat, but are not capable of much more.

   Llamas would be most effective in guarding against weasels, foxes and lone coyotes.  They are not effective against  loose dogs (one or in packs), wolves, bears, etc.  

   A llama can be brought down by a single dog with that intent.

   The number one killer of llamas is loose dogs.

   One lady told of her personal experience of having to help her neighbor "clean up" after two neighborhood dogs got into the area where her llamas were.  In less than an hour, two were killed, another was castrated and a fourth had serious leg injuries.

   Most felt that llamas were most effective if paired with a dog (or gun), and that the fencing should be the primary obstacle, as Linda mentioned yesterday.  
What works effectively for one farm, may not work for another.  Each should evaluate their threat potential and  their personal circumstances.  If you are home all day and can respond to your llama's alert with a gun or other action, then that may be very effective for you.  If you are gone much of the day and at work off the farm, then whatever is left "in charge" of the flock should be capable of doing the job to the best of its ability.

On a lighter note, there was a discussion here earlier this week about chickens and sheep.  We do have chickens and they free range and go anywhere they want to go....over fences, through fences, in and out of the woods, etc. We also have a resident fox recently coming for a chicken dinner now and then.  I have been in the sheep yard twice when the fox was within sighting distance and the first to sound the alarm (a few seconds ahead of the dogs) were our two guineas.  The dogs were at the fence instantly!  Quite an effective pairing for guarding...guineas and Pyrs!

Cathy
Perfect Spot Farm
http://www.patchworkfibers.com/perfectspotfarm.html

Sharon Hill wrote:

OK, I will put in my 2 cents.  I have had a Great  Pyrennes since the year 2000 and have never lost a  sheep to a predator.  My neighbor has cows and he  loses several calves every year to coyotes.      

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