[Retros] Hit Team theme progress
andrew at anselan.com
Wed Aug 30 15:17:27 EDT 2017
Sorry to not be in touch for a couple of days, but I was stuck in another part of the forest.
Two things are being confused, which sort of intersect in THC mate. Let me explain.
(1) What I was proposing here with "Hit Team" is the idea that all surviving units from both sides are homebase, *except* for the mating units.
(2) Noam I think was remembering an earlier activity in this mailing list, whereby all the mating side were homebase but the mated side were free to roam where they wanted. My file for these looks like this:
001 rnbqkbnr/ppppppp1/8/8/4P3/3B4/PPPPNPP1/RNB3RK w - - id PG 7.0 published retro mailing list 17-Nov-2006;
002 rnbqkbnr/ppp2p1p/5K2/4P3/2P5/8/PP2PPPP/R1B2BNR w - - id PG 9.0 Dedicated to Alexis Henri. StrateGems Jan-2007;
003 rnbqkbnr/1ppppppp/8/8/3P1Q2/4B3/1PP1PPPP/KR3BNR w - - id 9.0 published retro mailing list 17-Nov-2006;
004 rnbqkbnr/ppppppp1/8/8/4P3/6P1/PPPPN1PK/RNB2BR1 w - - id PG 8.0 published retro mailing list 20-Nov-2006;005 rnb3rk/ppp2pp1/2qb4/4p3/8/8/PPPPPPP1/RNBQKBNR w - - id PG 8.5 published retro mailing list - version Noam Elkies;All 5 of these are in WinChloe, and 2 are in PDB currently.
This theme was referred to as "total homebase mate", but later Roberto called in "Eight Officers". Just check the history for end of 2006-2007.
(3) Now obviously if you combine these two, then you get total homebase, but no mate is possible here, but I was wondering one might then relax the THB condition and have THC. weP & weP promoted to Q/R, wdP vanishes, together with bdP, beP, bfP bQ, bBs, bkN. But that seems too much of an ask, so that was what I'd reported I'd given up on. Sorry for confusion.
(4) Now Noam has just sent an email with a very interesting THC position - he is basically taking the Eight Officers idea and allowing for pawns to promote and return. But although this is very interesting, it still not what I was asking for.
Hope this clears things up. It's late here and I will tackle Francois Labelle's email tomorrow.
All the best,Andrew
From: roberto osorio <osorio.arg at gmail.com>
To: The Retrograde Analysis Mailing List <retros at janko.at>
Cc: juha_saukkola at hotmail.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 5:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Retros] Hit Team theme progress
I think that Andrew is referring to the "Total Home Circuit" feature. This means that all the white "entities" are on their starting position.The abstract concept is that after promotion, the "entity" is transformed, but it continues to be the same entity (piece).
The first example was,
1. Sc3 h5 2. Sd5 Th6 3. Sxe7 Tf6 4. Sd5 Sh6 5. Sc3 Ke7 6. g4 Ke6 7. g5 Kf5 8. g6 Kg4 9. gxf7 g6 10. Sf3 Lg7 11. f8=S Lh8 12. Se6 Dg8 13. Sf4 Tf8 14. Sg2 Kh3 15. Sb1 Sg4 16. Sg1#
"Can mate be delivered by the side which has all of its 16 men on their homesquares?"
An opinion poll over 10 master-level chess players in the Argentine Chess Club produced 100% of
wrong answers (?No?).Referring to the Osorio & Frolkin's article, ?THERE?S NO PLACE LIKE HOME?
(Using homesquares in SPGs)this is a white THC non-THB position showing the THC# theme. This diagram results from a triple circuit from and to homesquare performed by pieces of the same type (one type trick).
(Anm.: THC = Total Home Circuit) (2010-1-30)
2017-08-29 11:29 GMT-03:00 Noam D. Elkies <elkies at math.harvard.edu>:
>> [...] were you deliberately suggesting an obviously impossible task
>> (like finding a stalemate position where White has all 16 men on
>> their starting squares) and I didn't get the joke?
Juha Saukkola <juha_saukkola at hotmail.com> replies:
> I found nice position:
(later corrected: -Pa7)
> But this is more realistic:
-Ng8 (or -Pg7, -Bf8) to make it pure. These are nice, but
I specified "White has all 16 men on their starting squares",
and in your positions (with colors reversed) White has
fewer than 16 men.
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