[Jacob-list] LGDs

[Debbie Bennett]

I don't agree with some of the points brought up regarding llamas - I  
read of a study of llama effectiveness that stated that one llama can  
guard a certain number of acres (don't remember how many) for two to  
three years and then you needed to add another llama. The llamas  
don't kill off the predators, just keep them at bay, so the predators  
continue to breed and after a few years can overpower one llama. We  
are fortunate to have several hunters in our area that keep the  
predator population under control (for instance, last year, a certain  
bear was getting bold and now he is one neighbor's new rug). My  
experience has been...
>
> I have spoken with several people that use llamas as guardians and  
> swear by their efficiency, but after reading the comments on that  
> topic this week from people involved with both LGD's and llamas  
> (one was with llama rescue), I am now rethinking the issue for us.   
> Here are some of the points taken from those discussions.  These  
> are not my personal thoughts; I am merely passing information which  
> those of you who have (and like) your llamas may not agree with.
> Llamas should be thought of as a sentry rather than guard.  They  
> will alert and even rush to the fenceline if faced with a threat,  
> but are not capable of much more.
I have seen my llamas stomp dogs. They have chased off other  
predators (?). I have heard of them chasing off bears. My llama  
alerts the sheep, I usually don't hear him, and they gather behind  
him while he faces off to the "threat". My neighbor uses two llamas  
to a pasture and said, she heard a pack of coyotes one night and went  
out with the gun to see one llama gather the herd near the barn while  
the other three chased the coyotes across the creek at the far end of  
her pastures and then patrolled the fence line until the coyotes left.
> Llamas would be most effective in guarding against weasels, foxes  
> and lone coyotes.  They are not effective against  loose dogs (one  
> or in packs), wolves, bears, etc.
Something has been getting my chickens right under the llamas' nose -  
he doesn't seem to care about foxes, raccoons, skunks, etc.
>
> A llama can be brought down by a single dog with that intent
> The number one killer of llamas is loose dogs.
I'm not surprised by this, but also note, most people use gelded  
males with their fighting teeth removed (to prevent them from hurting  
each other when you have more than one gelding guarding). I use a  
breeding male with his fighting teeth intact and females in a  
separate pasture.
> One lady told of her personal experience of having to help her  
> neighbor "clean up" after two neighborhood dogs got into the area  
> where her llamas were.  In less than an hour, two were killed,  
> another was castrated and a fourth had serious leg injuries.
> Most felt that llamas were most effective if paired with a dog (or  
> gun), and that the fencing should be the primary obstacle, as Linda  
> mentioned yesterday.
> What works effectively for one farm, may not work for another.   
> Each should evaluate their threat potential and  their personal  
> circumstances.  If you are home all day and can respond to your  
> llama's alert with a gun or other action, then that may be very  
> effective for you.  If you are gone much of the day and at work off  
> the farm, then whatever is left "in charge" of the flock should be  
> capable of doing the job to the best of its ability.
I agree, however, most predators hunt at night.
Debbie Bennett
Feral Fibre Farm
>
> On a lighter note, there was a discussion here earlier this week  
> about chickens and sheep.  We do have chickens and they free range  
> and go anywhere they want to go....over fences, through fences, in  
> and out of the woods, etc. We also have a resident fox recently  
> coming for a chicken dinner now and then.  I have been in the sheep  
> yard twice when the fox was within sighting distance and the first  
> to sound the alarm (a few seconds ahead of the dogs) were our two  
> guineas.  The dogs were at the fence instantly!  Quite an effective  
> pairing for guarding...guineas and Pyrs!
>
> Cathy
> Perfect Spot Farm
> http://www.patchworkfibers.com/perfectspotfarm.html
>
> Sharon Hill wrote:
>> OK, I will put in my 2 cents.  I have had a Great
>> Pyrennes since the year 2000 and have never lost a
>> sheep to a predator.  My neighbor has cows and he
>> loses several calves every year to coyotes.
>>
>
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